What is "Meta?"

News Type: Other — Tue Aug 14, 2007 8:50 AM EDT

technology, newsvine, community, meta, metavine, categories, memes

There has been recently (oh, who am I kidding, there always has been) a lot of discussion going on around the vine that I would define as meta-discussion: how to improve the Vine, how to improve writing on the Vine, how to stop acting like @!$%#s and improve discussion on the Vine, etc, etc, ad infinitum.

In Thinking Rocks' recent article about "showcasing quality content on the Vine," a suggestion was made by Scott Butki: "I think it would be helpful to define meta because the way I've seen Brian use and the way I use it and the way Pev use all seem different."

And he's right. Some people do include in the definition of "Meta" articles and subjects that I would describe as "memes," i.e. "8 Things about Me"; community-driven articles i.e. "What was your favorite concert ever"; and community-building series or events like Newsvine Survivor or our ever-popular Newsvine Drinking Contests.

But are those things properly classified as "Meta?" Are they a sub-classification of Meta we could call "Community-based?"

Many have suggested that meta-content not appear on the front page, or be specially set off in its own module. But in order to do that properly, I believe we need, as a community, to define exactly what we mean by "meta."

And if we do decide that community-based articles, series, and events are not to be defined as "meta," then we need to decide what to do with them.

A quick Google search ("define: meta") brings up some interesting results:

"A Greek prefix meaning hind or posterior; used with Latin, latinized, or Green words to indicate the posterior (usually third) part of a structure)." (www.uky.edu/~mjshar0/HI/glossary/)

"Something on an abstraction level higher than the current. To go meta means to take a step back and look at the bigger picture - which can be done indefinitely in an arbitrary number of ways." (www.nada.kth.se/~asa/Game/Dragons/jargon.html)

"Prefix; after; changed, higher." (www.thepeacefulplanet.com/glossary.html)

"This is not an acronym. This is how posters flag the Subject: line of a post that relates to the newsgroup itself as opposed to BDSM." (www.mindspring.com/~frites/m.htm)

"A prefix used in computer science meaning "relating to" or "based on." For example, a metadirectory would be a directory relating to, or about directories. More simply put, a directory of directories." (www.scotsmist.co.uk/glossary_m.html)

"A prefix meaning "information about"." (www.armandproductions.com/Glossary.html)

"In epistemology the prefix meta- is used to mean about (its own category). For example, metadata is data about data (who has produced it, when, what format the data is in and so on). Similarly, meta-memory in psychology means an individual's intuition about whether or not they would remember something if they concentrated on recalling it. Any subject can be said to have a meta-theory, which is the theoretical consideration of its foundations and methods." (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meta-)

So the question goes to you, the Newsvine community: What is Meta? How do we define it in the context of this site? And what in the hell should we do with it once we've defined it?

A few suggestions:

Content that is specifically about Newsvine itself (i.e. articles like this one you are reading right now), should stay visible on the front page, and can be published to "All of Newsvine," as well as to appropriate groups (including, especially, Metavine), as it is news as relates to the community.

Content that requires the participation of the community, like Drinking Contests or articles which ask readers to supply an answer (i.e. "What book are you reading right now?") not be published to "All of Newsvine," but to specific groups to which they relate.

Meme-content, i.e. the recent "8 Things about Me," be published to specific groups only and not to "All of Newsvine."

All of this requires a lot of personal responsibility. Meme-y articles and community-driven articles tend to get a lot of response, a lot of hits, a lot of comments. (Isn't that why we write them?). And of course, the natural inclination is to get as much exposure for those kinds of articles as possible. But it's not like they'll disappear into the ether if they don't appear on the front page. They will get noticed, they will garner a lot of attention and comments, even if they don't spend 24 hours on the front page. Most people do not find what they read on the front page anyway--they have watchlists and conversation trackers to do that work.

There's also been much discussion about categories--how on earth should I categorize this article? I'd love a "Meta" or "Community" category in the category list, and a separate module for these things. But before we can ask Newsvine staff for a change like this, we have to define the subject for ourselves, and commit ourselves to properly classifying our content.

Now it's your turn: What do you think?

41 Votes
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7.0

{"commentId":945557,"authorDomain":"vikibabbles"}

Viki Babbles Gonia

Discuss amongst yourselves...I'm going to be gone all day at a funeral for my 93-year-old Great-Aunt Mary (essay about crazy Polish funerals sure to follow).

Let's make this a productive discussion, not a flinging back and forth of opinions, okay? I trust you all to be constructive, not destructive. It's time for this community to define this issue once and for all and ask for help from staff to properly categorize this stuff (and then to go ahead and properly categorize it ourselves once we've got more of an ability to do so).

{"commentId":945557,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"vikibabbles"}

5 votes

#1 - Tue Aug 14, 2007 8:53 AM EDT

{"commentId":945656,"authorDomain":"vicaxp"}

vicaxp

Sorry for your loss, Viki.

I dont like getting into these types of discussions because they seem to deteriorate quickly into BS and/or flame-wars and I dont have time or desier for that waste of energy.

I think many people are intereseted in what is going on with, around, to the writers/contributors they follow. I know it doesnt always seem to occur in the "mainstream media" at least not until that person has died and then a "retrospective" seems deemed to be acceptable. I dontwish to know more about the person once they are gone, I want to enjoy them when they are still with us.

If this means that I am pro-meta then so be it. I participated in the 8 things and enjoyed it and the other contributors very much. Where Newvine decides to allow those articles to appear, I dont care either way. The argument about whether those works are "quality" or not seems to be what I call "projecting" (imposing one's personal value system on something) and that is also IMHO a waste of energy.

Every day on this side of the dirt is a good day! And I, for one, dont intend to allow others to impact my days any longer.

Peace.

{"commentId":945656,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"vicaxp"}

9 votes

#1.1 - Tue Aug 14, 2007 9:38 AM EDT

{"commentId":947060,"authorDomain":"vikibabbles"}

Viki Babbles Gonia

I don't think that things like the 8 things meme aren't necessarily "quality." I DO like to know about my fellow writers. I think that's one of the best things about the nature of what we're doing here--we can get to know each other. But do those things belong on the front page? I think that's the question, along with whether or not meme-y type things constitute "meta" content, or "community" content.

And thanks. :)

{"commentId":947060,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"vikibabbles"}

2 votes

#1.2 - Tue Aug 14, 2007 5:13 PM EDT

{"commentId":947770,"authorDomain":"sbutki"}

Scott (Scoop) Butki

My condolences. Thanks for doing this piece to try to clarify this issue.

{"commentId":947770,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"sbutki"}

2 votes

#1.3 - Tue Aug 14, 2007 11:44 PM EDT

{"commentId":945665,"authorDomain":"prompt"}

prompt

I agree mostly with your quick definitions. To me, meta content is directly about Newsvine and the Community. Community content is interaction intended to be between Viners, largely through comments.

We have the Newsvine Community group so that we can splinter off the Community content off from the front page of the Vine, and I think more people need to realize that there is a standard we need to uphold. We may get a small boost of page views because we have spammed the areas where our content gets posted, but it degrades your reputation (unless you are popular, which allows you to post most anywhere), and at the same time Newsvine's reputation.

{"commentId":945665,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"prompt"}

5 votes

#2 - Tue Aug 14, 2007 9:44 AM EDT

{"commentId":947069,"authorDomain":"vikibabbles"}

Viki Babbles Gonia

So, Newsvine Community could be where things like memes and "What's your favorite latest CD?" belong. And Metavine is where articles like this one belong.

And, if we had a couple of additional categories available when posting: "Meta" and "Community," it would be easier to put this content where it belongs.

I felt awfully silly categorizing this as "Technology," but I'm not sure I had any better choice.

As far as:

it degrades your reputation (unless you are popular, which allows you to post most anywhere), and at the same time Newsvine's reputation.

I totally agree. When you're posting every fargone thing you write into every category, every group to which you belong, it absolutely degrades your reputation. It irritates people, and frankly, turns them off to your writing, regardless of the level of its quality.

The thing is, most people who are "popular" or have a high reputation go out of their way to ensure that they don't spam the living hell out of the Vine. That's why they're popular.

{"commentId":947069,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"vikibabbles"}

6 votes

#2.1 - Tue Aug 14, 2007 5:17 PM EDT

{"commentId":948648,"authorDomain":"sbutki"}

Scott (Scoop) Butki

Yeah I never know what category to put for things like this. Technology sort of makes sense. I think Brian put business for one meta type thing and that sorta makes sense. I've love a meta category but then I'd also like a fiction category.

re: clipping or sending to groups. Viki knows well I learned the hard way that you rub people the wrong way if you send stuff to too many groups.

But - and she can correct me if I'm wrong - I think I've gotten better on that front and now if anything I tend to clip to too few groups, if anything, i.e. not every media story goes to the media groups anymore. I figure if they want them someone else can clip them.

{"commentId":948648,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"sbutki"}

2 votes

#2.2 - Wed Aug 15, 2007 11:10 AM EDT

{"commentId":945744,"authorDomain":"brianford"}

Brian Ford

And he's right. Some people do include in the definition of "Meta" articles and subjects that I would describe as "memes," i.e. "8 Things about Me"; community-driven articles i.e. "What was your favorite concert ever"; and community-building series or events like Newsvine Survivor or our ever-popular Newsvine Drinking Contests.

Okay:

Meta is content about Newsvine, by members of Newsvine. There are "meta discussions" -- which occur in comment threads. There are "meta articles" which are articles about Newsvine, or members of Newsvine. I think there can even be "meta memes" which are memes centered around Newsvine or the Newsvine community. (This is different than a meme which circulates THROUGH the community -- but which is about "favorite cars" or something.)

And then there are articles that are simply one person asking: "What are your top ten favorite BLANK" -- and those aren't memes (as they're not viral) and they're not meta, either. They're chatty blog style posts which are intended to drive a discussion. I would add that it "is" possible to get smarter by reading them.

Content that requires the participation of the community, like Drinking Contests or articles which ask readers to supply an answer (i.e. "What book are you reading right now?") not be published to "All of Newsvine," but to specific groups to which they relate.

I'm not sure if you're saying this counts as meta -- but I disagree if you are. All content asks the readers to supply an answer -- or at least a comment or two. I actually dislike the "don't publish to all of Newsvine" thought because someone, somewhere is ALWAYS going to have an idea of what shouldn't be on the front page, above and beyond someone else's idea. It's particularly difficult, because that checkbox didn't come with an official staff sanctioned list of appropriate material -- or how to correctly tag items.

My view on that feature is: If YOU PERSONALLY don't think it should be featured or on the front page -- uncheck that box. I just wouldn't ever presume to tell someone ELSE that.

Last I checked, groups aren't mandatory -- and therefore some people wouldn't be allowed any exposure -- especially new people who've yet to join enough groups to make it worth their while. And, beyond that -- some groups are hit with so many articles that one seed/article is on the group's front page for all of an hour or two before being pushed off.

My thoughts on what to do with it:

Deal with it.

Those who don't EVER want to do more than write meta or blog style articles wont' stick around for long. OR -- they will simply realize that they want to write better content as they realize that their writing is improving. I got to a point where I almost feel like I always want to keep my newest writing above a certain level that I've achieved. That's not to say that I don't dip into the silly well on occasion -- I do -- but I made the personal choice to try and write "better" content and I got there by taking the time to write a lot of silly content and (yes) a lot of meta content.

I guess it just doesn't bother me to see meta stuff pop up on the front page. Newsvine works in cycles. One week -- meta is in. The next week -- interviews are in. The next week -- something else is in. During all that, all the same random quality articles of various types are sprinkled throughout.

{"commentId":945744,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"brianford"}

14 votes

#3 - Tue Aug 14, 2007 10:09 AM EDT

{"commentId":945762,"authorDomain":"ririaroo"}

Ben Josephs

What he said. ^ ^ ^

{"commentId":945762,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"ririaroo"}

6 votes

#3.1 - Tue Aug 14, 2007 10:16 AM EDT

{"commentId":945781,"authorDomain":"prompt"}

prompt

Brian I have really come around to your "deal with it" type of view lately. At first I tried to be the middle path, but too many people become whiny @!$%#es (excuse my language). Newsvine is the way it is, and both success and failure of material is directly dependant on the users. Take a stand, try and sway the majorities opinion if you really feel strongly about a subject, because it is the only proper and true manner to get results around here.

{"commentId":945781,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"prompt"}

9 votes

#3.2 - Tue Aug 14, 2007 10:20 AM EDT

{"commentId":945790,"authorDomain":"ririaroo"}

Ben Josephs

Additionally, "What are your top ten favorite BLANK" and meme's [I think] belong to Newsvine Community group, not published to all of Newsvine - it's bound to get ample attention there, anyway.

{"commentId":945790,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"ririaroo"}

6 votes

#3.3 - Tue Aug 14, 2007 10:22 AM EDT

{"commentId":945851,"authorDomain":"brianford"}

Brian Ford

I don't really agree, Ben. I think someone could very easily write a really GOOD "what are your top ten favorite" article, and there would be no reason to NOT publish it to All of Newsvine.

If I did it when I got here, I might say:

"What are your favorite this or that -- make some funny comment and leave it at that."

Now that I've been here awhile, and I've gotten a bit of writing under my belt, I would say:

"What are you favorite this or that -- make my own list, research the "this or that" on my list and provide some insight into "this or that" which can help people find something they might not know they like.

And, again -- I got there by learning to trust myself and by biting of smaller chunks before learning to write bigger, better articles.

In the same light -- I think someone could write a really good meme and actually spread some quality by doing so. Viral wouldn't be "bad" if it encouraged research -- for example.

{"commentId":945851,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"brianford"}

5 votes

#3.4 - Tue Aug 14, 2007 10:40 AM EDT

{"commentId":945914,"authorDomain":"ririaroo"}

Ben Josephs

If it's researched, I'll agree that it should be published to all of Newsvine.

Are people doing research when they publish them? I've haven't noticed.

{"commentId":945914,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"ririaroo"}

3 votes

#3.5 - Tue Aug 14, 2007 11:02 AM EDT

{"commentId":945917,"authorDomain":"ririaroo"}

Ben Josephs

Er, I've not noticed.

{"commentId":945917,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"ririaroo"}

3 votes

#3.6 - Tue Aug 14, 2007 11:03 AM EDT

{"commentId":945933,"authorDomain":"brianford"}

Brian Ford

So, again - we come down to your subjective view of quality. I'm comfortable making that assessment of my own work, but I'd never be so presumptuous to publicly demand my expectations of others in a community of thousands. Especially knowing that expectations are radically diverse in a community like this.

{"commentId":945933,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"brianford"}

5 votes

#3.7 - Tue Aug 14, 2007 11:06 AM EDT

{"commentId":946036,"authorDomain":"ririaroo"}

Ben Josephs

Heh. Well, I'm no elitist - I'm with you in just leaving it be. I don't particularly care about what goes on the front page, right now anyway. In the grand scheme of things, though, I'd like to see the NV Community group foster articles that are meant to incite personal discussions and probably shouldn't be on the front page in the future.

{"commentId":946036,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"ririaroo"}

4 votes

#3.8 - Tue Aug 14, 2007 11:37 AM EDT

{"commentId":946095,"authorDomain":"brashmonkey"}

BrashMonkey

Brian, you said almost exactly what I was thinking. I would agree that meta is restricted to writings about Newsvine. Meta requires that we step back in order to look at where we were standing. All else (not news or citizen journalism related) is community building -- which I happen to find incredibly useful as a component of this site. It helps to provide context for discussions and patterns. Since we cannot be face to face, our names--whether real or nom-de-plume--are little more than labels. Community-building articles help to flesh out those labels into a character. It is my belief that will make all the difference in the future of Newsvine. The meta articles...they serve to nudge a little here and there this huge community as it barrels into that future.

Whether or not such writing belongs on the front page? I'm not the one to say. It is my observation, though, that if people thirst for that sort of content, it should be available (in some way), and its popularity should wax or wane with the relative interest. Maybe that means it needs its own box on the front-page to be deleted or pushed to the bottom by those who are frustrated when it eclipses global news.

{"commentId":946095,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"brashmonkey"}

4 votes

#3.9 - Tue Aug 14, 2007 11:58 AM EDT

{"commentId":948685,"authorDomain":"sbutki"}

Scott (Scoop) Butki

That's not to say that I don't dip into the silly well on occasion -- I do -- but I made the personal choice to try and write "better" content and I got there by taking the time to write a lot of silly content and (yes) a lot of meta content.

Tell me more of this silly well. It sounds like something i must have fallen into once or twice lately.

{"commentId":948685,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"sbutki"}

2 votes

#3.10 - Wed Aug 15, 2007 11:25 AM EDT

{"commentId":946389,"authorDomain":"aine"}

Aine MacDermot

Meta : self-referential

In terms of Newsvine, self-referential material may be content about the Newsvine site, its developers, its software, the community as a whole, or individual members of the community.

"It's all about me/us, baby!"

{"commentId":946389,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"aine"}

8 votes

#4 - Tue Aug 14, 2007 1:29 PM EDT

{"commentId":957268,"authorDomain":"jfxgillis"}

jfxgillis

Aine:

Yes.

{"commentId":957268,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"jfxgillis"}

4 votes

#4.1 - Sat Aug 18, 2007 4:09 PM EDT

{"commentId":947114,"authorDomain":"damiankd"}

DamianKD

God, I hate the word "meme".

I'm all for a different category for meta and meme (ugh) discussions, with content separated from the rest of the news/opinion.

{"commentId":947114,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"damiankd"}

3 votes

#5 - Tue Aug 14, 2007 5:38 PM EDT

{"commentId":947126,"authorDomain":"brianford"}

Brian Ford

I'd prefer to take the partisan bickering off the front page. Nuke the whole politics section due to a few bad apples. (I'm only being half sarcastic.)

{"commentId":947126,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"brianford"}

4 votes

#5.1 - Tue Aug 14, 2007 5:42 PM EDT

{"commentId":947821,"authorDomain":"hamid"}

hamid.nyc

Which half Brian?

{"commentId":947821,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"hamid"}

3 votes

#5.2 - Wed Aug 15, 2007 12:12 AM EDT

{"commentId":948712,"authorDomain":"sbutki"}

Scott (Scoop) Butki

That's how I've always defined meta - like Aine does, as self-referential. As in my "why do you come here" piece or Brian's piece on using anonymous names here.

Brian, I half agree with you. I've done more "stop tracking" in the last few days than the rest of the time I've been here and almost all have been on issues that either started with ugly political crap or dissolved into ugly political crap.

{"commentId":948712,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"sbutki"}

5 votes

#5.3 - Wed Aug 15, 2007 11:34 AM EDT

{"commentId":948775,"authorDomain":"brianford"}

Brian Ford

Good to hear, Scott -- the next step is to avoid commenting on articles that you'll later feel the need to "untrack." That way, it's never tracked at all -- and it never shows up in my comment tracker, meaning it's one less chance that I'll see a disagreeable fight.

{"commentId":948775,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"brianford"}

3 votes

#5.4 - Wed Aug 15, 2007 11:53 AM EDT

{"commentId":948941,"authorDomain":"damiankd"}

DamianKD

Are you guys trying to tell me something about not getting into political fights? :)

I've done my share of discussing (and arguing) with folks who have different political or religious beliefs here on the Vine. Personally, I'm getting tired of saying and/or hearing the same things over and over again. I've also started avoiding conversations that are just blatantly stirring the pot. If there's an honest discussion, then I'll participate. If it looks like folks are just plugging their ears and talking louder than everyone else, then I'm out.

How's that for meta? :)

{"commentId":948941,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"damiankd"}

3 votes

#5.5 - Wed Aug 15, 2007 12:48 PM EDT

{"commentId":948995,"authorDomain":"sbutki"}

Scott (Scoop) Butki

Brian, it's hard not to make at least an attempt to save a conversation before goes into flame territory. Hell its tempting not to post "watch out folks I smell a lot of bs and crap being thrown in the next 100 posts" but I've resisted posting that... so far.

Damian, that's very well put:

Personally, I'm getting tired of saying and/or hearing the same things over and over again. I've also started avoiding conversations that are just blatantly stirring the pot. If there's an honest discussion, then I'll participate. If it looks like folks are just plugging their ears and talking louder than everyone else, then I'm out.

{"commentId":948995,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"sbutki"}

4 votes

#5.6 - Wed Aug 15, 2007 1:07 PM EDT

{"commentId":947117,"authorDomain":"ronco104"}

ron c. baker sr.

i am glad you wrote this piece ms. babbles because i felt i would be considered too stupip dor words if i asked "what is meta, what is meme'. i honestly did not know and i do feel too stupid for words. are there any other terms out there i should know, and am too stupid and cowardly to ask? please help.

luv,

ron

{"commentId":947117,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"ronco104"}

5 votes

#6 - Tue Aug 14, 2007 5:39 PM EDT

{"commentId":948885,"authorDomain":"vas"}

vas

You all realize, of course, that this article is "meta meta".

{"commentId":948885,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"vas"}

7 votes

#7 - Wed Aug 15, 2007 12:28 PM EDT

{"commentId":950116,"authorDomain":"vikibabbles"}

Viki Babbles Gonia

lol, vas. That's my favorite kind!

{"commentId":950116,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"vikibabbles"}

#7.1 - Wed Aug 15, 2007 7:40 PM EDT

{"commentId":952090,"authorDomain":"sbutki"}

Scott (Scoop) Butki

I think we need a newsvine meta theme song.

{"commentId":952090,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"sbutki"}

#7.2 - Thu Aug 16, 2007 1:38 PM EDT

{"commentId":950717,"authorDomain":"pschilling"}

pschillingDeleted

{"commentId":952687,"authorDomain":"onlynow99"}

Angel_C

Okay, whew...I'm more on Brians side of the line in that I like things pretty much the way they are--I'm using groups a lot as a way to group things and also keep an eye on my watchlist.

However, I do believe if there was a check box for community-type articles, it would at least move some into a page of their own. The label for that check box would have to be well-defined---perhaps we could use the label "meta" (if we can suppose people would understand what that means). I don't now enough about the programming side to figure out all the whys and what fors, but I suppose they could do something that if the community-type box was checked, it wouldn't go on the front page....if that's what we want.

Back to reading...

{"commentId":952687,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"onlynow99"}

2 votes

#9 - Thu Aug 16, 2007 5:00 PM EDT

{"commentId":957086,"authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}

Robert Blevins - AB of Seattle

Viki says:

'Many have suggested that meta-content not appear on the front page, or be specially set off in its own module.'

I have to go along with this idea. These type of Newsvine posts are not strictly news or straightforward opinion content. Probably don't belong on the front page. Other module...okay.

{"commentId":957086,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"adventurebooks"}

2 votes

#10 - Sat Aug 18, 2007 2:28 PM EDT

{"commentId":1046947,"authorDomain":"Boothby"}

Tim Boothby

I'd like to see a few additional categories:

Meta: Relating to Newsvine and how to make it better.

Meme: For the aforementioned 8 things and similar fare.

Writing: Some of us like writing odd little stories, others like writing contests, some just like writing fiction, help keep it all in one place.

{"commentId":1046947,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"Boothby"}

#11 - Sun Sep 23, 2007 6:02 PM EDT

{"commentId":1046957,"authorDomain":"vikibabbles"}

Viki Babbles Gonia

Great suggestions, Tim. Thanks.

{"commentId":1046957,"threadId":"137581","contentId":"895763","authorDomain":"vikibabbles"}

#11.1 - Sun Sep 23, 2007 6:07 PM EDT

{"canLink":false,"threadId":"137581","isPrivate":false}

VIKI BABBLES GONIA

Backyard

What is "Meta?"

Published to:

FUN STUFF:

COMPANY STUFF:

LEGAL STUFF: