Contacting Newsvine: Some tips and tricks. And a couple requests

That's what I meant -- the top right corner button (another reason to change the name -- it's both the name for the function, also one of the drop-down choices -- one of them needs to be re-titled).

But what's the Anti-Spam -- is that something else I can do as well?

New Question: (I'm curious if anyone else experiences this, as I've never seen it posted)

I use Firefox browser and create a tab for my homepage in the MenuBar. I click on it the 1st time, and conversation tracker appears. I click for a 2nd load, and conversation tracker shows what sometimes is an old count. I reload again, and NOW I get an actual count I can work with.

If I click on one of the top 2 new comments buttons before the 3rd reload, it won't access me at all, not until the right one comes up. It's just a minor annoyance, especially when the system loads slowly. Anyone else get this?

#3.4: Anyone else get this?

Yes... all the time (I use Firefox, too). It's a minor annoyance; I just refresh until the tracker looks "reasonable." While the tracker is one wonderful convenience and we'd all feel lost without it, it never has worked 100% well 100% of the time. When you pause to consider what makes it work at all, it is easy to understand how it cannot be perfect because, frankly, the things being tracked are in a non-stop state of flux. That the tracker works at all is, to me, near miraculous. I wish I could bear-hug the techie geniuses who developed it, because it is a fantastic tool that you really don't find anywhere else. Thus, I forgive it its little foibles and cannot praise enough those folks who developed it.

((((bitey)))

It is so good to see you again. Hope you are doing great!

I use firefox and google chrome. Chrome usually works better for me, but I still experience some glitches.

#3.6: Hope you are doing great!

I'm making steady progress. It's really about being patient - some things can't be rushed.

:-)

{{{{{MoCowgirl-1193719}}}}}

It's really about being patient - some things can't be rushed.

God bitey - that must be so frustrating for you!!! But thank god you are on the mend:)

(((((((bitey)))))))

#3.8: that must be so frustrating for you!!!

Yeah, I'll confess that it can be frustrating, and it gets more so the better I feel. But, this, too, shall pass... and I am so thankful for Newsvine, because it does help to pass the hours in a somewhat constructive way!

{{{{{Soph0571}}}}}

Viki----See #3.4 above. :-))

I click for a 2nd load, and conversation tracker shows what sometimes is an old count.

I don't think anything can be done about it. Dealing with huge numbers of users entails the use of multiple servers with vast arrays of hard-drives. It takes time for changes in data on one drive to propagate through the rest of the system. You might access one server and make changes one time, but then the next time you make a request, the first server might be "busy" and you wind up being routed to another server that the data hasn't reached yet.

I've run in to the same problem searching for pictures on Google. I'll view one picture on one page and then move on to view other pictures on other pages. When I try to go back and find the first picture, it's not where I thought it was.

thanx. The multiple servers makes sense. But as far as patterns go, I probably get 500 items a day in my tracker. At 3 hits to retrieve each, that's 1500 hits a day. Then there's the hits to check on what's come in, a good 1500 a day more. Since last August -- you do the math. But it sounds like it may not be fixable. Just asking.

Have you ever received a friend request and gone to accept it and it's not there? Or a group join request?

I chalk that up to impatience on the part of the sender. I thought it would be nice to have every member of the groups I'm in on my friends list. There's over 400 members in one group, so I send out 100 requests at a time. If they haven't answered in a week, well, too bad. There's a bug in the Pending Requests column that makes it impossible to manage more than about 60, so if they haven't answered in a week, then removed they become, to make room for the next 100. I still have 13 requests outstanding, but their "use by" date is past... Sorry...

If Newsvine ever does an Inactive Account Purge, I'm afraid you're going to be shocked. Out of that first 100 requests, I got ~21 new friends. So, I went back through the Pending Requests and found that about 65% of them hadn't been active on Newsvine in as long as 4 years. Needless to say, I check the Last Seen date before I send a request from here on out. I also check to see who the owner is of any groups I might want to join, though I haven't a need for groups here lately.

Why do I need lots of friends? Well, sometimes seeing items that other people are commenting on is the only way to catch items that I might be interested in, at all. If I don't like a particular subject, I can always hit the stop button in the tracker. I wish there was some way to add an additional filter in the Tracker to ignore certain tags on articles. That way I wouldn't have to take the extreme step of unchecking the box in the friends list on certain people who seem to focus entirely on subjects that I hate.

And if I hit the [2] button at the bottom of the Pending Requests, and it takes me to page 2 of the friends I already have, that's a bug. I've heard of spammers using the Contact Author button, but do they ever last long enough to acquire any friends?

I use the "Last Seen" date when purging my groups. If the date is more than 9 months ago, I will generally purge the member from the list. If someone hasn't logged in within the past 9 months I figure that person is likely gone for good. I have only rarely seen someone disappear for such a long time yet return.

And maybe needs a breathalyzer machine.

Oh, I hope not. That would cut down drastically on my entertainment....

requesting friendship from everyone who's a member would be silly.

When it's 9:00 PM CDT, the tracker's reading 0-0-0, and the same AP article has been headlining the front page for what seems like 36 hours, silly ideas sometimes come to mind. I really don't have that big a friends list, compared to some people.

Inactive account purge? I just threw up a little in my mouth. Trying to reassign groups whose owners have abandoned them or just don't care is a big enough puke-causer.

Automate it. I know it looks good when you can say you have a gazillion accounts, just don't ever use "active" in that sentence. But I guess keeping the accounts open prevents anyone from hijacking an old name for nefarious purposes.

I had a hard-on

Now I'm skeered...

So could the meal I bought tonight,

You don't forgo food and drink to stay on the computer? Oh wait, this isn't EverQuest...

My computer needs to block me from Newsvine after 10 p.m.

You could get one of those lamp timers that plugs into the wall.

Division by Zero why would you feel it necessary to "purge" your groups? I have been removed from at least one group for no apparent reason - Our Orwellian World. It kind of ticked me off, I never seeded off-topic material to the group or anything like that.

Come to think of it, I only discovered it after a somewhat lengthy hiatus from Newsvine, if that was the reason I think it's a poor one. Many people find the need to take a break from the 'Vine at some time or another for various reasons. That's no reason to de-group them.

Purging groups, especially large/cumbersome ones makes them easier to manage. If someone hasn't been around for months or even years it makes sense to 'boot' them. If the absent viner comes back all one has to do is request membership again. No big deal. If you were delisted for another reason, I expect it will come up then. I took over a group that had members who hadn't been seen for 3 years. Ultimately I edited down by half due to defunct membership. There is a movement, if you will, to re-focus groups, moderate better and try to eliminate the spamming. I don't think I would take it personally.

Nine months of inactivity is a very long time in internet terms. Chances are pretty slim that someone would return to a website after staying away for such a long time. If they do return, all they have to do is request membership again and they'll be in again. I like to limit my groups to active members. I'd rather have a group of 20 active 'Viners than 200 inactive 'Viners.

Amen.

Well, I wasn't away completely for 9 months...however I was mostly "lurking" and never noticed until seeding a topical article and noticed the group that I wanted to add/clip to was no longer there.

I guess I just don't see how members who you deem inactive are adding to your administrative workload in any way. You're free to administrate your groups any way you see fit, but just I don't see how those users are causing a problem.

I think of it as a matter of truth in advertising. Let's say you have a group with 700 members. Does it really have 700 members or does it have 300 active members and 400 who haven't logged into Newsvine at all in the past year? From an administrative standpoint I would want to know. Believe me, I had the same type of discussion in a church committee meeting many years ago when I proposed purging the church membership roster. I proposed purging anyone who hadn't been to church in 5 years. I thought it wrong to be claiming the church had over 2000 members when only 800 or so were active in any way. You would have thought I had proposed giving Satan a seat in the pulpit. I eventually won though with a compromise of purging those who hadn't been active in 7 years.

DOZ, Red Wolf,

So, what you two are saying is that you rule your group based solely on your assumption of a member's status.

Okay, so what is the "official" time-frame before people are booted? How long must they be inactive before you "assume" they are gone forever?

Oh, one more thing. Is this "official" time-frame posted somewhere for all members to read, or is this done at the discretion of the group owner?

Okay, so what is the "official" time-frame before people are booted? How long must they be inactive before you "assume" they are gone forever?

For my groups, that time-frame is 9 months. I'm not looking at whether you have seeded anything, posted an article, or even left a comment, I'm just looking at the simple fact of whether you have logged into your account in the past 9 months. Lurker or not, if you haven't even logged into your Newsvine account in the past 9 months you've pretty much tacitly informed everyone that you're gone. For example, as of today, 9 months ago would be October 25, 2009. If you haven't logged into your Newsvine account since October 25, 2009 chances are extremely good that you're not coming back. In my 4 years of being here I can only think of 2 people who were away from Newsvine for more than 9-12 months who did come back, and one of them was only here for about 3 months before leaving again. How can anyone say that they value being part of any particular group on Newsvine if they haven't bothered to log into their account in the past 9 months? I know one 'Viner who has admitted to me that she lurks on here. When she lurks she doesn't log into her account, she just visits the things that interest her and she doesn't leave comments. From time to time though she does log into her account so that she can see what her friends have commented on and to respond to comments on her own articles. It's not a behavior that I understand, but she's never failed to log into her account at least every 3-6 weeks. If she ever fails to do so for 9 months, I'm going to assume that she's not coming back. I haven't logged into my Facebook account in about 4 months. If I fail to do so in another 5 months I would have no problem at all if they suspended or deleted my account.

I think the only "official" word from NV on inactive accounts is in the UA, where it says, "If a user does not log in to his or her account for a year or more, the user account will be terminated and any accrued earnings will be forfeited." If Newsvine ever actually did an inactive account purge, people would be screaming when their huge Friends lists vaporized.

I was glad to read "Division by Zero" (and hope that most group owners feel the same) that he doesn't discriminate group members by participation with providing articles. I haven't been writing/seeding, yet enjoy reading some of the articles that are posted to my groups. Basically, I joined the groups that I did in hope of noticing articles I otherwise might not have.

Infohack #3.22----Did you check out the group Our Orwellian World any further? I noticed when I'd been deleted, and at that time, I was unable to actually find it in existence. I assumed whoever owned it had disbanded it. Haven't seen it around since. Maybe that's what happened to you...

Our Orwellian World still exists. It is owned by nearing who is an active 'Viner.

storyartist

No, it still exists:

http://ourorwellianworld.newsvine.com/

Glad to see I'm not the only one. I didn't inquire about it, since I don't really want to be part of a group that arbitrarily boots it's members.

Then nearing booted me. I did contribute articles, and I actually leave Newsvine connected online 24/7 in one browser tab, so no confusion there. Well, guess they didn't want me in their club. That's OK. If you put yourself out there, you'll attract that which is best fitted to you. Maybe she thought my contributions didn't fit their definition of Orwellian. Would have been classy to receive a notice of some sort. Different definition of classy probably, too. That happens in My Orwellian World!

storyartist, it could have been an accident, or, as I suggested earlier, some group owners might have their own criteria for keeping members. I don't contribute content, but I do read and comment. So, hopefully, the groups I joined will find that sufficient...You could join again, and see what happens, or contact nearing and ask questions, if you still want to be a member.

Nearing may have accidentally booted you. It's happened to me before, especially when using the touchpad on my laptop. Hanlon's Razor states, "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity." I think we are altogether too inclined to attribute to malice that which can adequately be explained by accident, incompetence, or stupidity.

Division... may I add 'curiosity, and interest' to that list?!! ..lol.

Most of what I have done on NV that was misinterpreted was simply due to my "curiosity" in the subject matter and "interest" in replying to other posters -- no underlying weirdnesses or motivations. ...Interpretation is everythnig sometimes!

I'm a little confused -- why would I reapply? And yes, misinterpretations happen, and mistakes happen. Somewhere on this article, the point was discussed about trimming down the groups to make them more manageable -- that's a good thing. I do that with my Friends list. Also my Ignore list. I keep them current. Maybe those un-friended wonder why since I, like nearing, don't send a notice explaining. Maybe they feel I'm un-classy as well.

Nobody's right -- and nobody's wrong. Until I offered my input about the group deletion (incorrect, as it turned out), I had no idea I'd been booted. All these things go around on the big wheel. The only misinterpretation seems to be here, though. I'm not angry. If someone doesn't want me in their group, I'd rather be let go than *tolerated*. I'm really OK with that. I'm 59yrs old, and I know about the "maybe this happened..."s. I'm just saying that I'll survive. And so will you, infohack. We'll all find groups that interest us, and that find us interesting, if we put ourselves out there. Hope I said that right...

Yeah, I think somehow I'll find the will to go on living despite the tragic setback ;)

Personally I think the group thing is overrated anyway. There's very little interaction among members apart from a little textbox on the group page that no one ever remembers. I generally check the front page, and my tracker to find articles and seeds, and rarely use the group pages. More often than not, the articles and seeds they contain are off-topic or dominated by one or two individuals.

I think the group thing is overrated anyway. There's very little interaction among members apart from a little textbox on the group page that no one ever remembers.

It was one of those features that NV initiated at the request of the community, but it never really played out the way it was envisioned, imho - kind of like when the chat feature was rolled out.

storyartist, just to make sure you didn't possibly misinterpret or vice-versa, I didn't take your comment regarding the group as you being angry - but I did read into your comments that you might still be interested in being a part of it. Sorry about that. That was the only reason why I suggest the group owner might have made a mistake, and if so, then why not inquire. But --I fully understand your reasoning on feeling that being deleted for any reason is good enough for writing someone off. I agree, no one is right and no one is wrong, it's personal preference, and nothing more.

I do wonder (and not suggesting your story at all with my comment) if 'politics' is ever an issue with the groups. I ask because I have a situation where a group of five have joined together to deceptively harass me. There are a couple of groups that I would have joined if they weren't on them, and one I removed myself because they were the group owner. This is one of the reasons why 'clipping' could be an issue in the future for me, if I decide to write.

Anyway, storyartist, I never doubted you wouldn't survive (lol) and I understand your point.

The Group function actually turned out to be what I had perceived the Friend function to be. I use it 2 ways. I use the email notifications from the groups I join, and also post to them when I initiate a seed/article. If I'm all caught up on tracker & email, I go to groups to find clipped articles posted there of interest. I've never used the "front page" of NV so this is a more targeted way to find something of interest.

I started joining groups because I thought there would be private discussion away from the derailers that just want to ruin discussion. I've not found any of that. Those little *chat* entries on the side go months without an answer, so I gave up on that. Maybe one day that'll improve -- or maybe I just haven't lined up with a group where I'd be invited for my particular outlook.

**CL1----now I'm in edit mode .. you slipped in there ahead of me. No problem. And, good point about politics. I avoid friend or group links to certain viners. That's another topic, unless that is possibly what happens to me. outta time....

Maybe one day that'll improve -- or maybe I just haven't lined up with a group where I'd be invited for my particular outlook.

I don't think you're alone in this experience. I have seldom found Groups useful for this kind of communication, either....sometimes for a bit of discussion about the purpose of a group, early on, but then after that the chat function doesn't get used much.

We do have some private group discussions, especially in my EroticaVine group, but for the most part the "group discussion" functionality isn't used. As for chat, several of us use GTalk (Gmail Chat) to talk socially with each other. The "GTalk Channel" used to be more active but either I've been kicked out of the club or it's just not as active as it once was. Anyone wishing to chat with me can contact me through my "Contact Author" link and we can make arrangements. Although much of my chatting is done through GTalk I also maintain Yahoo and AIM accounts for those who refuse to get on the GTalk bandwagon.

Storyartist --I only occasionally check my group's Homepage anymore because so often the authors I like to follow for their content were already on my tracker, so basically wasting my time with double entries going to the group page.

I wasn't expecting any private discussions with the groups, just articles specific to the topic of the group, basically, just making it easier to find articles. I thought groups were designed as a reference source, but they often seem to be used not much different than the Front Page. For the most part, I know where to look for what interests me, and the authors that I find write or seed what interests me, so it 'works.'

I got sloppy with my *reference* in my sentence. You wouldn't believe how much I have to correct that when I edit... the "one day maybe it'll improve" was intended to modify my comment about private discussion rooms, not the chat function.

I'm probably the only person on the planet with zero chat experience. A viner contacted me on some feature of Yahoo where we had conversation, but I really prefer email.

**CL1---ditto on the duplication of what you've already read -- which is why I scan for clipped articles, as those don't get notified.

storyartist, that's Ok on the "one day maybe.." -- I figured it out. ;)

I never chatted before Newsvine because I expected there would be too many boogymen and weirdos --- never in my wildest dreams did I expect that they all were right here on NV!! Hahahahaha!! ...live and learn.

Thanks for the info on clipped articles. I didn't know that.

Viki - I know how hard you work - I am always happy to hear from you of course - but I am never happier when I see them being deleted and I know you have worked your magic!!!

And here I thought you had a baseball bat.

#4.6: Head exploding button!

Eeeewwwww... brains and snot all over monitor...

;-)

I think a remote CPU blaster would solve a lot of problems.

I think a remote CPU blaster would solve a lot of problems.

don't tease me.....imagine the possibilities - *sigh*

Thrilling huh? Especially for you right now. It would melt like the witch when water is poured on her. We can daydream.

Of course - it would be in the air conditioned free trailer somewhere out there!

OMG, Viki....I know exactly which one you're referring to...!

a black t-shirt emblazoned with the logo of some long-defunct hair metal band.

Can't you just see them. Greasy haired - bald on top - long at the back - pot belly and really white spindly legs....

To complete the image, you need to mention the crumbs festooning the front of that black Stryper shirt, detritus from the eleven Miss Debbies' that were consumed during the Newsvine session. And the naked light bulb hanging overhead.

I was just about to finish the picture by being rather crude - re tissues etc - I will not go there - rather we should all use our imagination and go eeeewwww!

" detritus" --what an eloquent way to say, crumby! ...The next time we get slammed by someone on the Vine - instead of calling them all of kinds of despicable, foul names - we can say "Oh go eat Miss Debbies - you piece of detritus!! ... it 'almost' sounds like something bad!!

I was just about to finish the picture by being rather crude

Ah, the mystery of the missing socks on another article is solved.

Hehehe. Ewww! Hehehe.

You folks are just....twisted. :=)

Birds of a feather, etc.

Thanks Vic, but the inflamatory part, well calling Rep a bunch of @!$%#s seems well inflamatory, but Tyler is saying no its not so...I guess we can call the other side names to. Shame

Thanks for the answer, and I have only ever pushed the ! two times now. But Sscotts articles get collapsed alot and then restored. So this is telling me something.

Sherry working hard

Also Sscott was hit again by the roving left,

I think I saw that article today. It was a Meta article published to all of Newsvine in violation of the Meta Policy. Sscott was warned to change it in a comment from Tyler. Of course, delivering a warning about a violation in a comment is like pouring blood in shark-infested waters...

I haven't seen any partiality being practiced on Tyler's part. If everyone would play by the rules, there wouldn't be a problem. Some people like to see how far they can push, though.

Thanks Sir. I never saw the tyler comment. However I stand by what I said.

Someday I'll do an article quoting the emails that spammers send when their accounts are collapsed. Because THAT is hilarious.

Oh I want to read that article, please write it soon!

Ah right, yes. That was fun!

Actually, I have found a couple of the spammers quite entertaining in their methods to get around the system.

I've come across a few that have actually posted said methods, encouraging others to use them if/when their accounts were zapped. Pretty sure Tyler was not amused at those antics.

P.S.

KEEP censoring the truth.

Hmm.. *scratches head*where have I heard that before...?

And I thought I had it bad with sophiesucks.....LOL

Jeez - you gotta love them.....not. I am so glad that newsvine is strict about getting rid of them.... definite mental health issues

What I find particularly fantastic about that last one is that he clearly believes that he has the moral religious high-ground, despite all that evidence to the contrary. Thanks for keeping that sort of rubbish out, there are plenty of sites out there where users believe that constitutes informed debate, but here on the Vine we (thankfully) know better.

Wow, talk about venting; well, atleast the NV staff in Seattle have something to add a little laughter to their day! ..What I always wonder about is the connection to "Jews" that gets mentioned. Or is it just figurative speech?

Hahahaha! ... do any perks come with that? ...you know, a few golf lessons, maybe an advertising contract... wow, what an 'ass'et you could be to NV, Viki !!! ;-)

I'm glad I'm not the one having to answer messages like the one you showed in #7.8. It seems like it would be really difficult to keep a cool head sometimes... Kudos to those of you who have to deal with them.

rottlady,

No, I never meant to offend you at all. In fact, I was asking the question because you and I communicate well with each other. That's why I asked.

I do think the guides should be allowed to come to a thread and shake their finger at people. It's only my opinion, but I wish they would be allowed to put a temporary "hold" on troublemakers until their breach of the COH can be reviewed.

I am sorry Elizabeth if you misunderstood my comment, above. With the new meds, I am trying so hard to be nice and use nice words. I'm not always successful, but please know I meant no harm.

Susan

Abandoned groups are definitely a problem, and I think we need a means to solve it. As far as I am aware there is currently very little that can be done, I'll be interested to hear the answers to your question here.

Thanks, Red Wolf, I just clipped to the group Friendship Vine................very helpful.

Not my article, but may I say, bitey, how refreshing to see you back and posting on articles!! You are one of my earliest mentors, always willing to help. When you were in and out of the hospital, co-incidently, I was able to pay it forward a couple of times, using exactly what you had taught me!!

This was before the guides came in, and when I asked, people like you just came forward............

#22.1: This was before the guides came in, and when I asked, people like you just came forward....

Wow, Theresa, you just made my day! I've always been a meddler... when I know something that can help someone, I just jump in without thinking. I recall many jobs I've had where people simply refused to help new hires because they were afraid that the newbie might take the information and use it to push the oldies out of their jobs. I'm the exact opposite: anything that can make my employer do better, makes all of us do better, so I always tried to help everyone who needed it, and that included teaching people my own job, if doing so would help. To my knowledge, no one ever lost their jobs because of any help I offered, and when people do well and get promotions, that just makes my day.

So, my philosophy applies even to forums where it isn't a matter of profit or keeping a job, but even here I've seen cases where those with the knowledge nevertheless keep quiet when they could just as easily post helpful comments that makes everyone's experience better. I was thrilled to pieces when Newsvine started the Guides, because not only are they needed, but they add a certain air of "family" to the vine, and a sense of security in that those who need help know they can get it quickly and reliably from people without hidden agendas.

Anyway, I really am happy that I was able to help you, and, by extension, others whom you have helped. It really does make my day.

{{{{{Theresa N}}}}}

bitemore, you sound like you are a wonderful person. Jumping in to help will hopefully always come back to you, not that I'm a big Karma believer, but it just often seems to work out that way.

You sound like you are feeling much better. It's hard to have patience for healing, but just knowing that it will happen helps, I think. Have a great day.

#22.3: You sound like you are feeling much better.

Yes, I really am! I'm about to become my usual ol' nuisance on the Vine! Tee-hee!

{{{{{CL1}}}}}

You should send that in via the Contact Form.

I already suggested something similar in #3.17, and got an opinion in #3.19.

TA -- I've thought about that before also. We all may have 'some' similar interests, but most likely aren't interested in everything the other is.

The tracker is pretty complex and I think this would be tricky. I have, however, thought that there should be a tracker page, where you could filter things in the way you're describing. I also get overwhelmed by my tracker and simply clear it.

This may have been suggested before (SRO?), but I would like to see a "keep as new" button similar to the function with email. There are times that I would like to reply to a new comment, but at a later time; I wonder if others experience that.

This may have been suggested before (SRO?)

I've never seen it suggested before, but it sounds like a good idea. In the mean time, you could leave something like:

☺☻☼☻☺ I'll be back!

as the only text in a comment, so that it shows up prominently in the Latest Comments section of you column. Then you only have to click the text of the comment to come right back to where you left off.

Good idea, SRO, thanks for the suggestion!